Most doctors won’t admit to being a doctor in such circumstances anyway. If they do, they become responsible for the patient for the duration of the trip, and they don’t get paid. They may have to make a call whether to emergency land early (pissing off everyone on the plane any delaying their own plans) or risking the life of the patient. It’s a no win situation.
“But you don’t get paid! Why would you do something if you don’t get paid for it!”
The brain of an American seems to be fundamentally broken at this point
On call is not really what we discuss here, emergency may require a trained person to at least identify as one and try helping. Of course it depends on the legislation
Weve got a bootstraps mentality in the US. Its not worth helping others because 1. No one would help you and 2. Because youre putting yourself at risk by trying to be a good samaritan.
I spend my day around doctors. They take their Hippocratic oath very seriously, and this comment in no way exemplifies most of the practitioner behavior I observe on a daily basis.
The insurance companies and for-profit hospital administrators on the other hand…
If they are asking it is explicitly because it’s beyond basic first aid and they’re scared. The plane is landing either way, if they are already asking for a doctor, then the decision was already made by the pilots. Afterwards it’s a matter of providing proper care until delivered to a emergency services at the airport. All doctors I know will absolutely respond to such a call on a plane, but medical assistance doesn’t always include touching or doing something to the patient. Often, it’s just looking at them or talking to them (if they’re conscious) and advising the flight crew on what the proper care should be like. Ultimately, doctors are useless without proper infrastructure and resources. A surgeon without a hospital is as helpless as the patient and no first aid carries a pharmacy.
as a surgical specialist i am very not qualified to treat heart attacks (which other than chewing an aspirin and breathing oxygen requires a massive cath lab and an interventional cardiologist or a cardiac surgeon with a special OR including a cardiopulmonary bypass pump and a perfusionist; my current decent size hospital on the ground has neither of these) and barely more useful than a medical student at 99% of various medical problems a normal person may have. without a knife, anesthesia, and millions of dollars of equipment i’d just be asking chat gpt how to do breathing exercises with an elderly person having a panic attack
I have 3 close friends who are doctors, I have zero doubt they would jump to help in an emergency (I’ve seen them all do it at various times, though not on planes).
As usual Lemmy downvoting things they don’t agree with, even if it’s true.
I was with a physician friend on the Las Vegas strip as a guy went down with a heart attack. I’m like, this is your moment! Go save them! And she grabs my arm and yanks me into a doorway so I can’t make a commotion, explains that no doctor will simply do that, it means they’re on the hook for it, when an EMT is just minutes away and is properly prepared to handle it. She said if doctors didn’t obey this unwritten rule, they’d constantly be giving out care to random people, possibly without admitting privileges in nearby hospitals, taking on liability they’re not insured for (being outside of a hospital), etc.
I don’t think that a plane in flight is likely to have good EMT coverage.
There’s a significant difference between “we’re in an easily reachable party of a major city and I can expect a fully equipped ambulance to be here in minutes” and “we’re in mid-air and even if we make an emergency landing the patient won’t receive medical care for another hour unless I provide it”.
Most doctors won’t admit to being a doctor in such circumstances anyway. If they do, they become responsible for the patient for the duration of the trip, and they don’t get paid. They may have to make a call whether to emergency land early (pissing off everyone on the plane any delaying their own plans) or risking the life of the patient. It’s a no win situation.
No win, you know… except potentially saving another human’s life
Pretty sure it would be illegal to not help in quite a lot of countries, especially as a doctor. Apparently USA is not one of those countries.
“But you don’t get paid! Why would you do something if you don’t get paid for it!”
The brain of an American seems to be fundamentally broken at this point
All they have to do is have a glass or two of wine and say they’re not able to act in a professional capacity.
Unless you are incapacitated you need to help and two glasses of wine don’t count here. But again this is valid for “normal” countries.
2 glasses is over the limit for doctors. When on call you can’t drink even one.
On call is not really what we discuss here, emergency may require a trained person to at least identify as one and try helping. Of course it depends on the legislation
Do they serve wine on Spirit Airlines?
“is there a doctor on the flight?”
“yes! two glasses of picpoul de Pinet please”
Weve got a bootstraps mentality in the US. Its not worth helping others because 1. No one would help you and 2. Because youre putting yourself at risk by trying to be a good samaritan.
Gross
I spend my day around doctors. They take their Hippocratic oath very seriously, and this comment in no way exemplifies most of the practitioner behavior I observe on a daily basis.
The insurance companies and for-profit hospital administrators on the other hand…
If they are asking it is explicitly because it’s beyond basic first aid and they’re scared. The plane is landing either way, if they are already asking for a doctor, then the decision was already made by the pilots. Afterwards it’s a matter of providing proper care until delivered to a emergency services at the airport. All doctors I know will absolutely respond to such a call on a plane, but medical assistance doesn’t always include touching or doing something to the patient. Often, it’s just looking at them or talking to them (if they’re conscious) and advising the flight crew on what the proper care should be like. Ultimately, doctors are useless without proper infrastructure and resources. A surgeon without a hospital is as helpless as the patient and no first aid carries a pharmacy.
as a surgical specialist i am very not qualified to treat heart attacks (which other than chewing an aspirin and breathing oxygen requires a massive cath lab and an interventional cardiologist or a cardiac surgeon with a special OR including a cardiopulmonary bypass pump and a perfusionist; my current decent size hospital on the ground has neither of these) and barely more useful than a medical student at 99% of various medical problems a normal person may have. without a knife, anesthesia, and millions of dollars of equipment i’d just be asking chat gpt how to do breathing exercises with an elderly person having a panic attack
Not sure if it’s still the case, but airlines used to give flight credits to doctors who helped out. Probably not Spirit though…
Doctors can usually afford not to fly the best of the worst.
and clearly by flying spirit they don’t make sound life decisions.
however, same can be said for the doctor… so maybe they will speak up?
Source?
I have 3 close friends who are doctors, I have zero doubt they would jump to help in an emergency (I’ve seen them all do it at various times, though not on planes).
I’m a shitty person, therefore everyone else is.
Sure, I’m shitty. But I’m not a doctor. I’ve heard doctors taking about exactly this. And ones not from the U.S.
I don’t think you have any idea what you are talking about.
As usual Lemmy downvoting things they don’t agree with, even if it’s true.
I was with a physician friend on the Las Vegas strip as a guy went down with a heart attack. I’m like, this is your moment! Go save them! And she grabs my arm and yanks me into a doorway so I can’t make a commotion, explains that no doctor will simply do that, it means they’re on the hook for it, when an EMT is just minutes away and is properly prepared to handle it. She said if doctors didn’t obey this unwritten rule, they’d constantly be giving out care to random people, possibly without admitting privileges in nearby hospitals, taking on liability they’re not insured for (being outside of a hospital), etc.
So you’re completely right.
I don’t think that a plane in flight is likely to have good EMT coverage.
There’s a significant difference between “we’re in an easily reachable party of a major city and I can expect a fully equipped ambulance to be here in minutes” and “we’re in mid-air and even if we make an emergency landing the patient won’t receive medical care for another hour unless I provide it”.
So your data point of one american speaks for ‘most’ doctors globally. Sound stats.
Source: I made it up