More OEMs should ship devices with Linux as an option, discounted by the Windows license cost.
OEMs: Sorry, best I can do is tripling the amount of pre-installed bloatware that I get kickbacks on, to not only offset the cost but raise profits more
Here in Brazil, a lot of vendors are offering laptops with linux, but they do this just to offer a lower price, and put the most weird distro possible, that no one knew existed, so everyone who buys have to install their own os. The bad thing about it is that it creates a really bad first impression about linux on common users, who mostly end up asking the tech person from the family to install windows for them
Edit: another random fun fact: in order to offer a lower price, some brands around here also ship laptops with freedos, don’t ask me why.
Why don’t they just install Mint, Zorin, or even xUbuntu (XFCE versions of each)…
That’s 3 examples with actual support and a user base >3 edgelord cat bois.
I ask myself the same question. I have no idea. Mine is from vaio and came with some sort of modded debian that looked like a stripped down win xp with custom repos that didn’t even load properly.
You’d think that installing a niche distro like that is more difficult than one of the big ‘plug and play’ ones. Meaning they actively put more work into it, how strange.
Most distro maintainers would expect something for commercial licences. Can’t have them take all your hard earned money! Max I can do is 0$.
They’re usually gpl licensed. You can do whatever you want with it (including selling it for a bazillion monies) as long as you give the code too.
All the distroes are under GPL, so there is no need
No they wouldn’t. Where did you even get that idea from?
im surprised they don’t just do the underhanded method of acquiring windows.
well I’d imagine theres some stores willing to oblige doing that.
curious sakes, what distro do they preload on customers.
Yeah that’s weird. Quite a few of the smaller refurb shops here (south East Asia) just pirate Windows and Office suite.
Yeah I doubt my chinese MiniPC came with official Windows. Had recommendation tp go through initial set up offline. Not that I kept Windows. I wiped it and put Fedora on it.
Around here, institutions are quire rigorous with that, so stores have to play by the book. Only very small shops can sell pirate software without getting caught
About the distros, Each brand seem to put a different one, and they’re all weird. Mine came with some sort of modded debian with alternate repos, but was very impractical for use, and ended up installing fedora over it.
They just expect everyone to pirate windows
Exactly, but if we think about it, just putting some random well-established distro would be faster and cheaper than creating their weird modded versions or making contracts with weird firms. Maybe they want to avoid any unexpected legal issues?
Maybe it has some known vulnerabilities? The more reputable sellers I’ve seen around here (I’m also from. Brazil) just ship Ubuntu, it’s usually the sketchier vendors with the weird distros
Which brands have you seen shipping with ubuntu? I’ve seen vaio, samsung, asus and acer shipping with weird distros. They come like that even from the official stores.
Pretty sure Dell is ubuntu, dont remember others atm
The problem there is Windows still has negative cost for OEMs due to all the bloatware they bundle.
They get paid for that McAfee and Epic Games icon.
They used to have agreements to make it difficult to do so. I don’t know if that’s still the case but it’s pretty awful. I think OEMs had to pay licenses for every machine shipped regardless if it had a windows license.
The other issue is that oems have a large amount of compatibility and support built up over the years for windows. They also know their customers can deal with Microsoft for “support” and ignore driver and support costs for whatever distro of Linux they were to choose.
Sure an OEM could lead the way and show everyone else the path to freedom but think of the shareholders
They used to have agreements to make it difficult to do so. I don’t know if that’s still the case but it’s pretty awful. I think OEMs had to pay licenses for every machine shipped regardless if it had a windows license.
The Framework laptops have been selling out with backlog orders now. But with new models recently out, all the Linux ones sold out well before the Windows ones.
I think it just kind of goes to say, if you know a bit about computers, Linux is a go-to. Of course those that are a bit tech-savvy as well would just get a Windows one, clear it off and install the distro of their choice. Plus once upgrade is done, my OS and files are all there like nothing happened. Things like setting up Windows again on a new device or new install is like a full day task.
they actually make money on many of those windows preinstalls due to all the bullshit they get paid to put on.
The fun part is that they can bundle an equal amount of bloatware on linux for even more revenue.
The actually funny part is that they can’t. Most of the bloatware is not available on Linux because it doesn’t support it.
I’m not sure what you mean… linux “supports” bloatware just fine, it’s just that we don’t have much of that kind of software (yet), and i’m sure they could get it all to run through winboat or somesuch if they really wanted to.
Amid ram price hikes Linux has decided to double its license fee. It will now be available for $0
That’s twice as much as I was paying, I’m going to write a strongly worded email to that penguin guy
That’s twice as much as I was paying
Only half as much as I was paying, though, so I’m pretty happy about it.
Excuse you, that penguin guy has a name
Tux has had enough of this bullshit
He writes those right back so be prepared hahaha
Flatpak and Snap be like: Yes, we’ll double the RAM…
AND storage…
Linus better be watching it, or I’m switching to TempleOS
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The Tux trumpets are getting louder…
The lyrics are in C!
I hear those beautiful lyrics too, but I swear it’s actually in C#
Blastbeat of millions of penguins stomping.
I’ve been hearing Linux music for the past 9 years lol it’s incredible how much it’s improved as a desktop OS over that time.
Ah, the famous SuSE songs, instant classics.
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Oddly enough, many people apparently don’t even know of the SuSE songs, would you believe it?
This. Linux use on the USA is now over 10% in computers. And growing. I hope Europe follows the same path, but it is slow. Growing also. At home we all have ditched Windows years ago.
Really? I was thinking Europe would be leading in Linux adoption, kernel originating from Finland, distros like SuSE, NixOS etc.
Saw the data here, on Statcounter: https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/desktop/united-states-of-america. But now that I have searched it, it seems that maybe this spike is related to bots masquerading as Linux traffic https://www.pcworld.com/article/3204830/linux-didnt-actually-hit-10-percent-market-share-blame-bots.html.
Who knows, but indeniably, Linux is gaining attraction progressively.
Linux spike coincides with Windows dip. I believe Windows 10 will also be my last Windows.
Bah gawd, that’s Stone Cold’s music!
Let’s be honest… people who can’t figure out how to deal with Windows licenses wouldn’t be able to deal with a switch to Linux either.
This is about OEMs, which realistically only have 2 choices: Either sell it with windows, or Linux pre-installed.
The general public isn’t going to buy a device without an OS installed.People that can rub two neurons together have figured out they can get their 10yr old nephew to install something for them… so the included OS means nothing besides how it affects the final price. They’ll buy a laptop with Windows/Linux/no OS or whatever on it. In markets that don’t allow computing devices to be sold without an OS it doesn’t even have to be Linux, the vendors and manufacturers will happily slap FreeDOS on it to bypass the regulation.
Shit, even those who do know Windows will find it daunting.
I just bought a PC over the weekend to replace my PS5 (because fuck Sony) and I installed SteamOS onto it.
I am having a hell of a time figuring it out. It’s such an alien OS to me as a lifelong Windows user. I’m still trying to learn how everything works, like udev rules and the file structure/hierarchy it uses. It’s mad confusing, normal/less tech savvy people definitely wouldn’t be able to handle it.
SteamOS is not meant to be used on normal desktop/laptops. You’re making things harder for yourself.
I’d suggest Bazzite instead, still gaming oriented but it’s a lot more user friendly than SteamOS which is moreso designed with the steam deck and steam machine in mind.
Yeah, a friend of mine well-versed in Debian suggested I switch to Bazzite.
The main issue I was having with SteamOS is I couldn’t wake the PC up from sleep with a wireless peripheral of any kind. Went into BIOS and made all the necessary changes and whatnot.
As much as I absolutely despise it, AI was able to assist me with a udev script that worked first try. I was mainly hoping to get my 8bitdo Pro 3 to wake the system since it had a 2.4ghz dongle/station, but even my PS5 controller can wake it now via Bluetooth, no matter how much time has passed.
Now that I don’t really need to worry about switching to the desktop, it’s been a pretty great experience so far.
udev rules is a bit of a deep end dive tbf. There are enough Linux distros where you can stick to the desktop most of the time.
Personally, what I hate about Linux is terminals and having even less reliable information about what has gone wrong. I will revisit Club Penguin in a couple of years, provided that Valve has further expanded SteamOS to the desktop PC.
In the meantime, I am using Windows Enterprise via Masgravel activation, installed via RUFUS, and paired with ShutUp10 to improve privacy without having to be a guru. ShutUp10 also has a paid version that automatically reverts changes that Microsoft does to privacy settings.
No Chris Titus?
To me this is positive news. The less appealing Windows machines are, the better. Let Windows PC rot peacefully.
While I understand your sentiment about Windows, this is how you end up in a world filled with iPad kids who become adults who accept technology that they don’t own.
Walking down the aisles of any store selling computers, I can attest to this. If a company can’t sell a Windows computer, they will simply sell a Chromebook instead.
Or a manufacturer finally decides to make a budget Linux laptop that starts selling better than expected.
Y’know, some manufacturers used to do this actually, and more might start again.
I still miss my Acer 5315 that came with Linux. It was an instant buy.
Only if we stay quiet.
So the computer without Windows/with Linux will be cheaper, right/ 🥹
Yes. Plenty of manufacturers do sell computers without windows.
Insert the Padme Anakin meme here.
If a company is doing it it’s already is. But most are selling you windows compulsively.
Huh, that changed? The last time i bought a Laptop in 2018, it was still more expensive to get one without Windows preinstalled.
Oh, they fucking do that? Bloody hell, that’s low. Maybe it depends on a country, but when I bought my previous Lenovo around 2019, they had an option without the OS and it was slightly cheaper, and only available for a small subset of laptops.
The only new laptop I got since was Framework, and obviously, they’re also great in this regard, but I feel like they’re outliers.
Yes, that exact thing was the crux of a major lawsuit at one point.
Always was… just had to find the seller who sells you the laptop without a prepurchased license/preinstalled windows. Sadly was always higher tier stuff that had a choice.
Ah, yes. Decreasing market share in a shrinking market segment? Obviously, the solution is to raise prices!
Microsoft continues to be one of the greatest Linux promoters in the world.
This is the way of the world right now.
“Oh no, things are going bad for us, raise prices so we will be OK when this dies!”
Screw the future. Sad times.
I didn’t expect my PC to become a better investment than my house - until the bubble pops.
Now I also know the feeling of buying something when it was more affordable. I can now dish out advice like “You should just buy fewer boba teas, so you could afford a PC like I did when buying it with my student loan.”
Every RAM stick I bought in the past 15 years is worth more per GB now than when I bought it… If you bought RAM in 2008 the same is true, I just didn’t buy RAM at that point.
Look. It’s simple. You’re paying for Copilot, whatever you want to or not.
A year of Linux desktops indeed. I’ve switched PC and a laptop to Linux and guess what? Works better, faster, more secure and I fucking love it.
Never ever going back to Windows. I might run win10 in virtual pc, but never main host and nothing => 11
Yepppp.
Played around with all of them for a bit. Settled on Bazzite. Dead simple to install and use and it has t given me any issue at all.
Pop OS was kind of nice too, but it needs another year in the oven.
I would love if pc manufacturers would just ship laptops with e.g. Linux mint or fedora and just knock off the windows licence cost. I don’t even mind if they have to ship it with bloatware, that’s fine, as long as it just doesn’t ship windows. Savvy users will just uninstall it
It’s possible to get refunds for unused OEM Windows licenses in the EU.
Wow, nice. It sounds like Asus makes it the easiest, reimbursing for the license without shipping your machine to them. I don’t understand why the others that will reimburse require physical inspection of the machine.
to discourage you to do so
This, and probably clearing the license from BIOS. Otherwise you keep the license. Not sure how Asus resolves this. Maybe they just don’t care.
I’d guess something using armory crate.
I would love a tick box setup. Maybe 2 Linux distro options and a windows option for +$X or whatever so ur laptop can arrive ready to set up with the OS desired on it. Should lower cost for customers who don’t need windows, and maybe people on the fence will decide window isn’t worth however much more it cost to get and order the Linux version. The more units are sold with Linux the more incentive there will be to sort drivers for more hardware etc.
Dell has this.
https://www.dell.com/en-us/shop/dell-laptops/scr/laptops/appref=ubuntu-linux-os
No clue if you’re still paying for the Windows license in that price though.
Lmfao, here comes manufactures selling their own versions of Debian and Fedora. I bet we’re going to see a rush of manufacturers selling blank no OS PC’s with hardware being the only added on cost.